From: Curtis Johnson
To: William Putnam
Date: Feb 23 1998 10:17:56 pm
Subject: Case #5 3/4
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WP> remain in Therese's body.  Even a drop of water that may
WP> have trickled down her throat in the process of brushing
WP> her teeth was immediately ejected.  For this reason, she

> How on earth could one possibly check such an
> assertion?

WP> Maybe the writings of the doctors are still
WP> available to read.  How is your German these
WP> days?

Use your skull.

WP> presume to deny it in Therese's case because of its alleged
WP> impossibility would also have to deny all the other certified,
WP> incontestable cases of inedia that are found in the lives
WP> of other saintly and specially favored people.

> "Favored people"?  Depriving someone of the pleasures
> of a good meal for decades is supposed to be a favor???

WP> Again, the choice is the individual, not God's.
WP> By "favored people," I mean those so blessed
WP> with the visions and wonders this woman had.
WP> Oh, I did not tell you the other phenomenon
WP> this individual had.  But I will simply refer
WP> you to the recommended book.

Visions as well?  Like I said, a mental basket case.

WP> All these cases were subjected to the most gruelling
WP> investigations from both sides, pro and con, and found
WP> to be authentic.

>	While I don't have the Catholic Encyclopedia, or a
> listing of saints, your source seems to have picked very
>obscure and hard-to-verify names, if they existed.

WP> You doubt it?

You inserted that question right before the line that
answers it.

> 	I rather doubt that investigation would have been more
> thorough than for Neumann, and we've already seen how weak that
> claim--basically, Neumann's word for it.

WP> Read the book, Curtis.......

Which reminds me--when are you going to read a little
about chemistry before you yammer again about chemical reactions
being random?

WP> In not one of these cases has this supernatural phenomenon
WP> ever been "explained" by human investigations and laboratory

>	Very easily explained by fraud, though.

WP> Now, I challenge you to do so!  First start
WP> by reading the book I recommend and them
WP> go digging for negative material that may
WP> disprove the case.  I suggest a good brush-
WP> up on your German as you do so.

Have you dug into those two 17th-century books on
King's Evil yet?

WP> "One very important reason which leads us to believe in the
WP> unquestionable genuineness of Therese's total abstinence from
WP> food is the fact that Therese is deeply grounded in a peculiar
WP> phenomenal relationship with the main ecclesiastical Sacrament,
WP> namely, the Holy Eucharist or the Last Supper." So wrote a
WP> priest who was present on the eve of a Palm Sunday.

>	She feels fervently about communion, so this itself
> is a good reason to think she doesn't need to eat food?
> Huh?  This is evidence of anything but that priest's utter
> gullibility?

WP> Hey, he was there, Curtis.  If I were there and wrote

I wasn't questioning that she was fervent about
communion.  I was saying that this is no reason at all
to believe that she didn't need to eat food.  Indeed it
isn't.  That he did and you do think that is good evidence
for her "inedia" shows that you both are indeed fucking

WP> the same things, you would still be skeptical, like
WP> a guy I read about in the Bible - Thomas is his name,
WP> who put his hands into the side of Christ and felt
WP> the nail wounds in His hands, and then he believed.

Interestingly, the passage seems very careful to
avoid stating that Thomas actually took Christ up on the

WP> What will it take for you to believe in God, Curtis?

Don't really mean:  what will it take for me to
become a Catholic?  (After all, Jews and Muslims--and the
Roman Empire worshipers of Serapis--also claim to believe
in the same God.  They also have their own set of miracles.)

WP> that I don't eat!" The priest continued, "Do you want to be
WP> greater than the Saviour?  While on earth He ate like we do."
WP> Therese laughed out loud and answered unswervingly, "The
WP> Saviour is able to do everything.  Or don't you know that He
WP> is almighty?"

WP> Then she turned to the priest once more and continued with
WP> great emphasis: "Father, the result from nothing remains
WP> nothing.  I do not live on nothing.  I live on our Saviour.
WP> He revealed to us: 'My Body is truly a food.' Why should
WP> this not truly be the case, if it is His will?"

>	Note that she didn't answer the priest's question.

WP> Huh?  Sorry, but I thought her answer an excellent
WP> one!  We are on different wavelengths, Curtis.

Inedia doesn't make even good theological sense.
If the ideal is the imitation of Christ, it is not imitating

WP> weight.  When she was investigated in July of 1927, Therese
WP> weighed 121 pounds.  In 1935 she weighed 140 pounds.
WP> During my visit with her in 1945 she weighed in excess of
WP> 185 pounds; in 1950 she weighed over 200 pounds, and in 1953
WP> her weight had reached over 215 pounds! I mentioned to
WP> Therese in 1953 that she had gained weight since I last saw
WP> her.  Her laughing reply was, "I will no doubt be as heavy
WP> as my grandmother!" She, too, was a large woman and weighed

>	Beginning to notice how she tries to laugh off
> inconvenient facts?

WP> So what?  She was a happy person, Curtis!
WP> I wish I could have experiences the joy this
WP> woman experiences in her ecstacies!

Hysterics are attention-cravers.  She was the star
of her own show.  Of course she'd be happy.

WP> In 1945 I had jokingly asked her what she had done with her
WP> ration cards during the war.  She laughed and replied, "You
WP> know, Mr. Vogl, there are many mouths to feed in the Neumann
WP> family!" (Actually, she gave them to the poor, as she herself
WP> told me on another occasion.)

>	IOW, she can't keep her story straight.

WP> How you compile such a statement is beyond me,
WP> Curtis.  I think we are at at the end of this
WP> thread.............

>	Oh, the condesension!  I am wounded!

WP> Poor baby!  :-)

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