Messages From mkimes@ibm.net
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Re: opinions, opinions
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: opinions, opinions Al.B.Schroeder@f17.n116.z1.gryn.org (Al B. Schroeder) said: Appeal to authority dismissed. You've no _data_ to base your assertions upon, do you? |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: opinions, opinions
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: opinions, opinions Al.B.Schroeder@f17.n116.z1.gryn.org (Al B. Schroeder) said: Incredibly stupid, Al. We _do_ happen to have a great deal of data on what those other bodies are like, don't we? But we have _no_ data on what the universe _might_ have been like we have data only on what the universe _is_ like. You may speculate to your heart's content (sans data, of

Re: opinions, opinions
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: opinions, opinions Robert Curry <curry@gte.net> said: Nor does Al get his references right. For example, Al has named Paul Davies as someone who supports his side. Yet Davies actually says quite clearly: "In the popular imagination, God is a sort of cosmic magician who sits somewhere beyond the sky and from time to time works miracles. As a scientist, I find the very

Re: opinions, opinions
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: opinions, opinions Robert Curry <curry@gte.net> said: Having read many of those books, I feel rather confident that Al _cannot_ do so. In point of fact, with the possible exception of Ellis, who writes more as a theist than scientist in what I've read of him, Al doesn't even _understand_ what his dropped names have written, else he'd realize that all (again, with the

Re: admitted bullshit
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: admitted bullshit Robert Curry <curry@gte.net> said: Precisely. And nothing wrong with those speculations, for the most part. They're good fun if nothing else, sort of a "what-if" game played on a universal, or even super-universal scale. The problem here is, as I'm sure you know, simply that Al doesn't understand what he's reading. In his way, he's very much like a KJV fundy

Re: ACLU News 01-30-97: Chri
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: ACLU News 01-30-97: Chri Richard.Smith@f9046.n203.z1.gryn.org (Richard Smith) said: which you have no Totally off topic, and probably not interesting, scientist Paul Davies says he does believe in purpose, unknown to him, to the universe, specifically without an outside agency a purpose that is simply inherent in the way the universe is. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: 2 2 Designer
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: 2 2 Designer Andrew.Masten@f255.n138.z1.gryn.org (Andrew Masten) said: whatever other That ain't science, unless one has an _evidenced_ mechanism. Appealing to little men bowling in the hills to explain thunder isn't science unless you can produce the little men. Ditto for explaining apparent (perceived) design by appealing to a designer that no one can produce. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: 2 Designer
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: 2 Designer Andrew.Masten@f255.n138.z1.gryn.org (Andrew Masten) said: Fatal flaw in your "logic" here, Andy the correct response to "we don't understand this yet" is _not_ "gods dunnit!" any more than it's "demons dunnit!" The correct response is "well, let's keep looking." Doubt it? How about an example? Was the correct response to "we don't know what causes disease" ever "the gods are cursing

Re: Xtian murders
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Xtian murders Steven.Saus@f150.n271.z1.gryn.org (Steven Saus) said: It was well known that the Nazis were rounding up and exterminating Jews prior to the liberation of the camps. Remember, there were Jews fleeing occupied territories in droves, some of them even winding up in America, films of what was going on in the streets of Berlin, and even good ol' Adolph announcing his intentions to

Re: Shelby Sherman
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Shelby Sherman Current usage is: warlock n. A male witch, sorcerer, wizard, or demon. [Middle English warloghe, from Old English wErloga, oath-breaker wEr, pledge -loga, liar]. Note that the roots of witch, wicca and first part of warlock are all the same: weg and derivatives like wEg. It would seem that _all_ these words are insults developed by xtians over the

Re: Ken Young Quotes
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Ken Young Quotes Ken.Young@f430.n270.z1.gryn.org (Ken Young) said: "Besides, if it's omnipresent, why can't we see it?" |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: ACLU News 01-30-97: Chri
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: ACLU News 01-30-97: Chri Richard.Smith@f9046.n203.z1.gryn.org (Richard Smith) said: According to Davies, no. He believes in purpose, unknown to him, to the universe, specifically without an outside agency. IOW, he believes the universe has purpose but does not believe it was _given_ purpose. Remember, these are not my beliefs, nor do I endorse them. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: Darwin's Black Box.
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Darwin's Black Box. Laurie.Appleton@f238.n640.z3.gryn.org (Laurie Appleton) said: The only one stupid enough to make such a straw claim is a goofy little fundy called Appletoon. And yer such a wimp even yer strawmen kick yer ass. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: First cause 2/2
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: First cause 2/2 Andrew.Masten@f255.n138.z1.gryn.org (Andrew Masten) said: Not the least of which is that there's no evidence of anything capable of designing universes. Well, aside from, perhaps, humans. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: 2 2 Designer
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: 2 2 Designer Andrew.Masten@f255.n138.z1.gryn.org (Andrew Masten) said: Again, Andy, we couldn't help noticing that you didn't answer the question. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: Holyfield has forgiven
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Holyfield has forgiven Shelby.Sherman@f67.n123.z1.gryn.org (Shelby Sherman) said: Well, that and, perhaps, that Evander got into a bit of trouble himself for biting in the ring, once upon a time... |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: 2 2 Designer
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: 2 2 Designer Andrew.Masten@f255.n138.z1.gryn.org (Andrew Masten) said: ROFL! We didn't fail to notice that you did fail to answer the question, Andy. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: Ark stuff
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Ark stuff John.Brawley@p1.f435.n100.z1.gryn.org (John Brawley) said: That's not a parameter, it's an unwarranted assumption, John-boy. Look up both words, parameter and assumption, in a dictionary. They are not synonymous. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: Ps
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: Ps Al.B.Schroeder@f17.n116.z1.gryn.org (Al B. Schroeder) said: regular, Why should Judith goo someone else just because you hate her, Al? You're not making sense as usual. Hec |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org

Re: admitted bullshit
REPLYTO 1:2424/12.1 UUCP REPLYADDR holysmoke@gryn.org GID GIGO+ sn 245 at tor250 vsn 0.99.970109 From: mkimes@ibm.net Subject: Re: admitted bullshit Al.B.Schroeder@f17.n116.z1.gryn.org (Al B. Schroeder) said: Robert Of _course_ you do, Al. You _believe_ it because you don't _understand_ it. That's painfully obvious. You're exactly like a fundy misinterpreting the KJV to get it to say exactly what he wants. |Fidonet: Echo Gateway |Internet: holysmoke@list.gryn.org